Merchants of Change

00:00:00:17 - 00:00:30:20
Speaker 1
This week on Merchants of Change, we talk with Portia Jenkins. Portia is a three sport athlete turned educator, turned sales professional. Today, Portia is the manager of commercial sales development for Tripp actions. Portia spent a lot of time leading a team of buyers, and she's got great advice for New sellers. Here she is, Portia Jenkins. I'm J.R. Butler, co-founder of The Chef Crew.

00:00:30:21 - 00:01:00:12
Speaker 1
And you're listening to Merchants of Change. Oh, this is a podcast about transferring the skills and behaviors we acquire as athletes into being a professional technology salesperson each week, we'll introduce you to a top performer who will help us understand how they became professional merchants of change. What's up, kid? How are you, Portia?

00:01:01:01 - 00:01:04:06
Speaker 2
I am fantastic, J.R. How's the day going so far?

00:01:04:19 - 00:01:28:16
Speaker 1
It's going great. Thank you so much for being on the show. I'm really excited to have you. I'm not sure if you had a chance to hear any of our episodes, but it's a show that we really build for new sellers and really people that might be considering a career shift into technology sales. And, you know, most of our guests are former athletes who have found success in sales.

00:01:29:00 - 00:01:36:06
Speaker 1
So if it's all right, I'd love to start with your sports background a little bit. Tell us a little bit about your experience growing up playing sports.

00:01:36:15 - 00:01:57:00
Speaker 2
Yeah, so I was a three sport athlete all through junior high through high school and then eventually play intercollegiate volleyball. And that was the one that you weren't on the team just yet, but I wanted to more of a college experience. But early on I knew sports was a huge part of my life. It was a way to escape kind of all the day to day things.

00:01:57:00 - 00:02:16:11
Speaker 2
But it also taught me what I think are the intangible things that have ultimately helped me to be successful today. Also just the camaraderie I have for my teammates. And those are my lifelong friends and still to this day have huge bonds with Warsaw about those series that we never got over or the ones the ones that we had.

00:02:16:11 - 00:02:23:08
Speaker 2
So for me, having that opportunity to build through sports has been monumental in terms of like who I am as a person.

00:02:24:07 - 00:02:46:12
Speaker 1
I love that I was a three sport athlete myself growing up and you don't see it a lot anymore, right? Like there's a lot of people specialized at such a young age. So I always love people that played multiple sports. Did you do you have any like favorite memories or your single favorite memory of of playing sports? Like, what's your number one top memory?

00:02:47:09 - 00:03:03:10
Speaker 2
I remember that I found out that I wasn't a runner. I decided to join Cross Country and I was like, you know, in the offseason I was a basketball player committed through and through. To be a basketball player and coach is like in the offseason you have to do another sport. I'm like, well, what are the sports are going on right now?

00:03:03:10 - 00:03:20:18
Speaker 2
And they're like, Oh, cross country need to beat people. And I'm like, okay. So I wrote my first race and I like twist my going to go for whole and I just remember hopping all the way to the finish line and thinking, I'm going to finish this. However, I'm not going to be back tomorrow. Is volleyball still available and the coaches like.

00:03:20:18 - 00:03:38:23
Speaker 2
Yeah, absolutely. And I became a volleyball player that day, committed in high school and it ends up working out very perfectly. But I just remember that day I was like, you're not a runner enough, okay? And I just laugh about it because it's just like you would think I would be, but I definitely was not. So that's the most funniest one for me that comes to mind.

00:03:38:23 - 00:03:59:19
Speaker 1
I love it. I like it than what I've always found. I'm not I can't run like more than like 400 meters, right. Versus the fast switch muscles don't do they just translate to those longest that runs in any day, any way. Not at. I learned the hard way. Yeah you made a comment and I totally agree with you.

00:03:59:19 - 00:04:09:00
Speaker 1
Like my my favorite part of playing sports my whole life growing up was the teammates. Do you have any do you have any like personal favorite teammates that you had growing up?

00:04:09:12 - 00:04:30:21
Speaker 2
Yeah. So I met my best friend actually playing on that same team that same year in volleyball, and we ended up being three sport athletes together. And she was what I call like my equalizer. Like I was definitely someone who was tough, but also, you know, I needed someone to also help keep me in check. And I think she had she was that then.

00:04:30:21 - 00:04:48:10
Speaker 2
And I knew like I could count on her to like, look at her and she'd be like, stop or green, like. And so I knew then right away that we would be best friends forever because she was just so smart and just so even keel on most things. Everything. I wasn't in those moments. She was, and I just thought we balanced each other out.

00:04:49:08 - 00:05:01:07
Speaker 2
But again, like one of those moments came through sport and if I didn't join the volleyball team after rowing my ankle, I don't know if we would have been best friends because we shared in those moments together, like after that through everything else. So it was kind of great. It was great.

00:05:02:00 - 00:05:06:11
Speaker 1
Nothing better than the friendships she was. She was the yang to your yang. We all know that.

00:05:06:16 - 00:05:15:05
Speaker 2
Oh, yeah, still is. To this day I call her and she's same thing like or. Yes, that is an excellent choice, Portia. So it was meant to be for sure.

00:05:15:23 - 00:05:19:18
Speaker 1
I love it. How would your teammates and coaches describe you from your playing days?

00:05:20:08 - 00:05:37:15
Speaker 2
Oh, I think there are two sides to me. Very much so. The player side of me, like in game situations, was tough. Like I wanted to win, I wanted to be in practice, like going hard at it every single day. Like, what are you doing getting water right now? We need to be on the floor together. Like getting after you.

00:05:37:15 - 00:05:57:20
Speaker 2
Like, what are you doing? But then there was the other side of me that was like off the court, wanting to have that unity, wanted to have that camaraderie. No matter if you were the freshman or you were the sophomore who were playing up on varsity, like, I felt like it was important for those people to feel respected and a part of the team, because I had been in those moments where you got brought up too soon and people were just not kind.

00:05:58:01 - 00:06:07:19
Speaker 2
It it really stunts your growth in terms of like you feeling a part of a team. So I think they would say like I was a tough cookie to the core, but I was definitely the go to person that kept the team together.

00:06:08:14 - 00:06:17:15
Speaker 1
I love that. And I had I, I don't even have to ask you, but that is, I'm sure, translated to what you're doing now, which was. Oh, yes, sure, sure. Everything.

00:06:17:20 - 00:06:23:12
Speaker 2
I was like, This is who you've always been. And I'm just so happy that you've made it.

00:06:23:12 - 00:06:46:02
Speaker 1
I love it. That's so awesome. You you've got a really interesting background. You're different than probably most of the folks that we've talked to and I personally like. I love it. You started, you know, you had a retail sales position for Sprint and then you were, you know, eight years. I think as an educator. And then you went to GON, which is like, you know, famous, right?

00:06:46:02 - 00:06:57:00
Speaker 1
Like one of the the best BTR organizations in the world. Can you talk like tell me a little bit about your path to that first sales job at GON Yeah, for sure.

00:06:57:04 - 00:07:13:19
Speaker 2
So it was kind of one of those things where obviously Kobe hitting in, it's kind of changing the landscape of how we all work every single day. And for me, like I was at that point where I had eight years of K through 12 teaching, but I also taught two years in college. I taught adults before I actually taught children.

00:07:14:03 - 00:07:37:04
Speaker 2
So during my Masters in Micronesia getting my master's in kinesiology, I actually taught adults first. And so I had a taste of what it would be like to teach in that space. But then having COVID hit in, honestly looking at how things were changing, it became pretty clear to me that, you know, as an educator, I was going to be on the front lines of this and I wasn't prepared and felt like for my family shape that that would be okay for me down the line.

00:07:37:09 - 00:07:54:13
Speaker 2
So I had to kind of do this reset of like, hey, when were you the next best, happiest in your career? And that made you feel super filled. And I immediately got back to that spirit job because I got that job fresh out of college. Like that was my first real job. And like outside of going to school and having the, you know, work study stuff.

00:07:54:21 - 00:08:09:07
Speaker 2
So for me, the reason why I didn't stay in it was because it was fast tracked me to an area where I didn't feel like I should be first. And so when it came time to re choose, it was kind of like, okay, well, working in Silicon Valley already, I have a partner who is already in sales. I hear about the day to day.

00:08:09:07 - 00:08:35:18
Speaker 2
I've met these people in some regards, so I'm like, How can I make this transition and do it in the most awful way? That'll set me up for success. And so my player in and immediately went, it's like practice preparation, so how do I do that? So I went out, I like Googled all of the best bootcamps that you could potentially ever work for, work with and I was that same week boot camp came up and one of those nights of searching and it was like, Hey, we need to take people from nontraditional backgrounds.

00:08:35:18 - 00:08:54:02
Speaker 2
Here I am a teacher, wanted to make this transition in me, help them understand the baseline, my skill set to be a BTR. And additionally, we have these opportunities where you get to do interview coaching and all those kinds of things and I'm like, This is it. And after that it was like, I'm going to do this weeks, I'm going to commit to this as I transition out of my education role.

00:08:54:03 - 00:09:01:05
Speaker 2
So I'm still teaching and finishing up my educational career while doing this bootcamp. And in October of that same year, I had a job. I go.

00:09:02:07 - 00:09:29:20
Speaker 1
I love that. That's amazing. In and around, you know, the boot camps are amazing. Obviously, where we're an option for one of those. But I think anybody that is serious about this switch needs to that's a really good foundational and they're all great like all of them. Right. So that's awesome. And I love by the way, like I always think like sales has a lot of parallels between teaching, right?

00:09:29:21 - 00:09:49:12
Speaker 1
Like at the end of the day, gray sales reps are educators because they're educating the customer on a problem that they solve, how they sell that uniquely, and becoming a subject matter expert in their technology. But obviously there's challenges. What were some of the challenges you faced during that kind of course correction from education to sales?

00:09:50:01 - 00:10:05:02
Speaker 2
Yeah, I think because I did it virtually, it made it a little harder. I think if I would have had the reverse and been in office, I don't think I would have had much more. I don't want to necessarily call it struggles because I think there were teachable moments. I think that we all find out a lot about ourselves.

00:10:05:03 - 00:10:25:09
Speaker 2
We faced with new challenges. But I think not being on the floor with actual people doing the work or hearing those little nuances and having to be siloed, it made it a lot harder to like ramp up as fast as I wanted to because now I'm like, I'm listening to Gong Calls or I'm reading all the books, I'm listening to all the sales leaders, and it's like noise.

00:10:25:09 - 00:10:42:18
Speaker 2
Instead of just being the streamline power to like, This is what you need to do and this is how you do it. It was like I was pulling from different areas and I think that as a first time BTR was like the struggle because it's like, well, this guy's getting 300% and this one is saying this is the right path to get to this part.

00:10:43:04 - 00:10:58:21
Speaker 2
So just having more of a streamlined process was probably my struggle because I'm a curious person. I want to know everybody's money and I want to figure out in those moments what can I pull from it and make it my own? And I think it just was a little overwhelming considering that I was also working from home and not having an office experience.

00:10:59:22 - 00:11:22:06
Speaker 1
I love that you said that because, you know, I'm a I'm a I'm a huge believer in learning through osmosis, right? Like just walking walking around on a sales floor. You have to try not to learn. Right. So there's a lot that that happens just being around your peers and leadership. So you made a big career change right out there.

00:11:22:11 - 00:11:32:09
Speaker 1
You did the academy in the boot camp, which I love. Are there any other like strategies or tools that you'd recommend to someone that's in your spot? Because we have a ton of them that are doing the same switch.

00:11:34:02 - 00:11:52:18
Speaker 2
As you mentioned, education has a lot of parallels to sales, and I think you really understanding your value in whatever you've done outside of the sales world is super important because you're going to go into these calls and people are going to be like, this is very nontraditional. And it's like actually there's a lot of parallels to education in sales and not just even in the BTR space.

00:11:52:18 - 00:12:23:03
Speaker 2
We think about customer success. We think about working with different stakeholders. We think about what it means to upsell, cross-sell. You do all of that. And so when it comes to when you come into a transitional space, really think about your value and how it aligns with the role that you want and be able to talk about that in that kind of way because you may be educating them on your value in a way that they've never thought about it, but also just be prepared to not just tell people where you are, but show them it how valuable asset you can be because you are a company coming from that space.

00:12:24:06 - 00:12:43:20
Speaker 1
I love it. I love it. The coaching we give them is you have to tell your story in the context of this new role, right? It's one thing to say. It's one thing to say you're resilient. It's another thing to say you're resilient. And here's an example. And it's like best practices are resilient. Here's an example and here's why it matters in this new role.

00:12:43:21 - 00:13:11:06
Speaker 1
Right. That's the that's the fall cycle that you want to really go through. And. Exactly. You locked that in on education, which is amazing. We and I had a feeling that we share an opinion on this. But I battle we battle with sometimes our customers and we see it on LinkedIn all the time about companies that are shying away from candidates who don't have formal BTR sales experience.

00:13:11:06 - 00:13:39:21
Speaker 1
Right. We think I think it's short sighted. Right. And we like you said, we tell our candidates to tell a story about your background and why they actually are qualified for the job. And you talk a little bit about how you created a compelling story about your background and experience. What is your feeling in general about that kind of belief of like, hey, we need to hire people with with our experience?

00:13:40:11 - 00:14:00:05
Speaker 2
You know, I it would be short sighted to believe that that's not the case because I do think that there's something to be said about someone who's invested their time into really honing their craft and building that experience. Do this. Be our space. But I also think it's short sighted to not think that someone who's coming from a different viewpoint can't contribute to that.

00:14:00:12 - 00:14:20:21
Speaker 2
Because the thing about shows, and I think you mentioned this in one of your podcast, I was listening to privacy like salesperson shift can be taught the intangibles are the things that essentially people learn through experiences that are not all the same because unless you're hitting 150% plus across the board, we have room for growth here and we need some new synergies and new mindsets and new ideas.

00:14:21:01 - 00:14:49:08
Speaker 2
And typically that comes from people who come from different backgrounds and or have a different viewpoint that may not be represented so often. And often I tell people is that, you know, when we look at sales reps and their potential, we often have to look beyond their work experience to actually talk to them about what's happening. And anybody that's smart enough and like I just mentioned, will be able to paint a story and make those connections for people to be able to show and tell them excuse me more about who they are and how that fits their organization.

00:14:49:12 - 00:15:07:04
Speaker 2
And I think that's the difference, making a difference doesn't necessarily mean that indifference is, in most cases, the thing that you need to help move things along, not only from a PR perspective, but from a cultural perspective. Diversifying the thinkers in the room truly brings you an opportunity to grow as a company. I believe.

00:15:08:00 - 00:15:35:05
Speaker 1
I love it. I love it. I, I, I couldn't agree more, by the way. That's amazing. We I'm really excited to get your opinion on this. So we, we have people that are kind of coming through our process. And usually, you know, I think we do a pretty good job of coaching them through the interview process. And, you know, typically what happens because we don't do exclusive, exclusive agreements with our customers.

00:15:35:05 - 00:16:10:09
Speaker 1
So typically our candidates are getting multiple, multiple at bats and then multiple offers. Right. And when they come back to us and they say, okay, here's my three offers, right? They're talking a lot about base salary, variable comp benefits, hybrid versus remote or whatever. Right in your mind. And you landed at an awesome place to start. What are some of the other factors that are really important when these these career switchers and these trans transitioning athletes should consider when they're evaluating who they're going to work for first?

00:16:11:00 - 00:16:35:02
Speaker 2
Yeah, I think what I thought about my first beta role was completely different when I went to my last one or when I transitioned to connections, for example, I cared about the money, the OTP first, because let's just be honest, we're moving here because there is earnings, there is money to be made, but also the remote thing wasn't an option for me, even though I would have been a top reason.

00:16:35:11 - 00:17:02:13
Speaker 2
It wasn't an option benefits for sure. But as I look at it now, it was shortsighted because when it comes to the things that are important to me, I care about enablement, I care about my ability to grow and it be an actual built out structure. I also care about obviously the money, but when it comes to start breaking those things that are important, I obviously want a good salary, but I also want to make sure that I'm able to grow within a company to continue to increase the salary.

00:17:02:17 - 00:17:23:17
Speaker 2
So if you start out with a high dollar and then there's no growth opportunities, you're going to stay the same for a while. So what I always say is like, you should always have a close list in any job that you take, right? What are the best things about this company that you like? What are the words that you're just like, you're not going to work, but what are most important things to you that's above everything else?

00:17:23:17 - 00:17:43:04
Speaker 2
What's important to you, and what did each of these companies bring and what don't they bring and write them? I think as much as we are interviewing candidates, they are they should also be interviewing us. And I think that's how, you know and identify what's the place in the space for you, because you're going to be spending a significant amount of time at this organization, whether it's in-person or virtually.

00:17:43:09 - 00:17:57:00
Speaker 2
And if it does not align with who you are as a person, no money in the world could ever convince you to stay in. It's never going to make you happy in the short term. You're going to have happiness, but eventually you're going to say, like, what am I doing here?

00:17:57:00 - 00:18:17:09
Speaker 1
I and I think you'll appreciate this. I also think a really important characteristic of that first job is who you're working for. Right. It's just is that somebody you're going to learn from? Is that somebody who's going to you're going to vibe with on a date? Because that's the person that you're reporting to that that's really responsible for your success.

00:18:17:09 - 00:18:37:11
Speaker 2
Amy Absolutely. Absolutely. And I think that also impacts your growth. Right. And I we I talked to you talk to our candidates and I talk to specific and I say, like, if the vibe does not feel good to you, do not continue on. Like don't work for a company just because it's cool work for a company because it actually has aligns with your values and you'll be proud to say that you work there.

00:18:37:11 - 00:18:53:20
Speaker 2
And one thing I also did not say in that first part was addressable market work for a company that's going to allow that product to be sold. So you can continue to talk to multiple people across multiple industries because that's going to give you a wider viewpoint of being able to talk to folks across all levels of business.

00:18:53:20 - 00:18:59:05
Speaker 2
And that's what's going to ultimately hone your skill sets when you have that level of business acumen. You can't be touched.

00:18:59:23 - 00:19:22:22
Speaker 1
Can't be. I love it. We we get a lot of kids and athletes that come into our kind of process and they're like, you know, they're taking their first job. They're carrying the water bottles, building their foundation. You just talked about. But they're all initially, I think the thought is, okay, I'm going to be BTR, then I want to get into a closing role, right?

00:19:23:08 - 00:19:42:17
Speaker 1
You and what I, what I always emphasize with them, hey, there's other paths, right? You can go in to customer success, you can go into account management and these other things, and you can go into leadership, which is kind of the path that you've taken. How did that happen and what's it been like for you now that you're you're leading people?

00:19:43:01 - 00:20:03:03
Speaker 2
Yeah. So I kind of always knew that this is where I want it, right? I going in, it was like I never had the real conviction to be like I want to be that. It was like, that's the natural path that people are supposed to take, right? And for me, it didn't feel like the right path as my as my history dictates.

00:20:03:03 - 00:20:19:03
Speaker 2
It's like, hey, I don't mind taking a chance on myself to learn and or get an opportunity to try something new that is going to ultimately help me in either direction. But I knew that I wanted to get back to the coaching. I wanted to get back to helping people figure out who they are in the space, helping people develop.

00:20:19:07 - 00:20:41:07
Speaker 2
All the things that I did as a teacher and a coach all these years is now the same thing, you know, in sales. Right. But now I guess these are adults once again that I get to do that with. And I felt more at home with that opportunity. Not to say that sales will never be a path for me because I was actually presented with both literally on the same day and they both were in front of me and it was like, What do you want to do in it?

00:20:41:13 - 00:21:11:21
Speaker 2
The first instance was people I want to lead, people, I want to help people grow. I think that's my path. I think that feels like home and that will make me happy in the space. So as I as I look at sales leaders, I, I admired them a lot. And I definitely feel like it's important to have a company that also still will allow that path to be present in a couple of years if I choose to shift or make changes, if that's something I thought about and maybe a possibility in the future, make sure it exists at the company that you currently work for.

00:21:12:02 - 00:21:28:18
Speaker 2
I would suggest that too, but push yourself to really think about what you care about for the long term. Don't go down the traditional path. If that's not really what you see, you can create a path for yourself because it'll have opportunities will not end when you're good. It will not for you. You don't. You have to look for it.

00:21:28:20 - 00:21:32:02
Speaker 2
Find you. So just be open to it.

00:21:32:02 - 00:21:54:15
Speaker 1
I love it. I love it. We're now we're going to give some some anybody who's interviewing at Trump actions is going to get a little inside baseball because we really I'm so excited to get your perspective on like what good looks like for buyers right now. So if you think about some of the best leaders that you've worked with, can you describe how you saw them approach the job?

00:21:55:07 - 00:22:25:05
Speaker 2
Yeah, yeah. I think they lead with curiosity. You know, these are folks who are constantly working to refine their skill set. They're not people who who rest on their laurels, so to speak, but they're always looking for ways to improve. They literally attach themselves to the best people in the company and not in a be inauthentic, but because they actually want to learn and they're taking what they're learning and they're applying it because it's one thing to read a book and it's one thing to have the conversations, but it means absolutely nothing if you can't actually apply it.

00:22:25:14 - 00:22:41:08
Speaker 2
And I think the best speakers tend to be those that are curious and want to actually go out and do that. And they also have the best energy like they they want to come in every day. And I'm not saying you have to be like jacked up every day, but it is something about their presence makes everybody around them better.

00:22:42:07 - 00:23:03:10
Speaker 2
And that to me is what I look for in a buyer. And I tell people I want people who are coachable, who are competitive and who have probably some of the best energy possible added. You can be the quiet person because you can still contribute to the team, but people are going to you are trying to figure out what is it that you have that's helping you be successful or you can be the loud mouth that helped rally everybody, get them going.

00:23:03:19 - 00:23:22:17
Speaker 2
Gladstone The phone people hear you though, and they figure out like if you want to be like that or you don't, but you know, you have like a part. And so when I look at a team, they don't always look the same. I don't want them to I don't want them outperform the same because I want us to all contribute to this organization and this team in an authentic way that helps us all be better in LA.

00:23:24:00 - 00:23:45:16
Speaker 1
I love that. It's so true. Every every team I think of that I've ever led had a different personality. It's it's so true. And it's the personality of the team is the leader first, but then everybody else that that contributes. Did it did anyone, by the way, did anyone plastic pop in to you? And when I said best PDR that you've ever worked with, like I don't want to match position.

00:23:45:23 - 00:24:03:09
Speaker 2
Yeah, I have two actually I have one from my previous team that also came from an education background. And she was fantastic because how she looked at the job was from a lens of How do I make this better? How do I have better conversations? How do I go find the information that's going to stick with this persona?

00:24:03:15 - 00:24:21:07
Speaker 2
How do I? It was very meticulous about what she did, and it made her such a like she was a sponge that was able to then go talk to other people. Right. And that to me is like what it's about. It's like, I don't want to necessarily have all the success for myself. I want to be successful. However, I want to help inspire and help other people grow.

00:24:21:07 - 00:24:39:00
Speaker 2
Right. And she did such a good job of that. And I look forward to just seeing her continue to blossom to the leader that she is already. And then there's one most recently that I found. It's just like this quiet leader that has like the stoic approach to things, but it's so intelligent. You can just when you talk to him, it's he's not giving you lip service.

00:24:39:00 - 00:24:53:23
Speaker 2
He's giving you the information that you need and that you want. And he's constantly trying to evolve each and every day. And I like their very pull up personalities, but their goals and the way they get to the end goal is the same in terms of their drive. And I and I just, I love it.

00:24:54:04 - 00:25:11:12
Speaker 1
It's so cool. And it's and it's so true. It's not want there's not one thing that's right. It can look different for everybody. I have to imagine you have probably bidders that join your team for that are like, I want to be I want to be a rep as quickly as possible, but what do you have those types of people?

00:25:11:12 - 00:25:13:19
Speaker 1
What do you have them focus on as a leader? Yeah.

00:25:14:12 - 00:25:38:11
Speaker 2
I think the biggest thing is tailoring our expectations because listen, growth happens at different rates. And I think the first thing you have to do is have that honest conversation like, listen, before we both commit to this journey together, we got to be realistic, right? We shoot for the long game and let's just say the long game is what we're going to make this goal in anything great because of how you put in your effort makes that shorter.

00:25:38:11 - 00:25:59:13
Speaker 2
That's awesome. But I want to tailor your expectations because if you don't do that initially, it will create either not this transparent, not direct conversation that you're chasing something. And when it doesn't happen, now becomes the moral shift. Now they'd have. They don't trust in the company and that person got me here and you don't want to do that so often.

00:25:59:13 - 00:26:24:02
Speaker 2
I start with a very candid conversation and I understand what their goals are. And I say before we sign, like not after, before, just to make sure we're on the same page here, that this is the expectation, this is the likelihood. But if it happens, because you come in here, you're coachable, you're you're competitive, and you show up every single day as a professional that's doing a really good job and is trying to be the learner and implement those things.

00:26:24:10 - 00:26:29:12
Speaker 2
You can potentially make that shorter, but that's up to you. Your growth is in your hands, essentially, in that way.

00:26:29:13 - 00:26:39:18
Speaker 1
Yep, yep. That's one one phenomenal kind of aspect to sales is that you're in the driver's seat every single day. It's on you. Your accountability is here.

00:26:39:20 - 00:27:05:12
Speaker 2
You don't you don't get that in very many professions. And I think leaning into that and making sure they understand, like you truly control this like so when it comes to the opportunity wasn't provided to me. I was like, Where you ready for the opportunity? Did you contribute to being ready for the opportunity? And then when you say that to people, most folks who are mature enough will say, I could have probably done this better, but then you may have some that say like, No, you guys didn't give that to me.

00:27:05:12 - 00:27:13:06
Speaker 2
And those how you that's how you know who's who, right? If you can take that mindset and have them really come to that point, that's what, you know, kind of recap.

00:27:14:02 - 00:27:35:14
Speaker 1
We had a huge sign on our sales floor that said no victims. Right? You're not a victim. No victims. Right. You need to lose that mentality if you're going to go and have success in sales. Another big part of that, the kind of BTR role. In my opinion, the best videos I've seen have unbelievable relationships with the A's that they work with.

00:27:35:14 - 00:27:39:18
Speaker 1
Right? How are you coaching up your readers to work with their account executives?

00:27:40:03 - 00:28:07:16
Speaker 2
Yeah, I've seen it. Both sides. I've experienced it. Both sides of me having a really great experience where we were, we were it was necessary friends. We were professional colleagues that respected each other. We were equal partners. And I think that's the key to a really good relationship because we know that our goal is to for sure get to a point where we're helping each other reach this mutual goal that we have set our revenue goals and targets are contingent upon each other.

00:28:07:16 - 00:28:26:16
Speaker 2
So we're not competing here. But also, I think the worst ones put leaders in this lesser them position and that's to me is the worst thing you can possibly do. And I and I don't blame me for that. I also say that refs are responsible for not allowing that to happen and also not seeing themselves as less of it.

00:28:26:21 - 00:28:37:15
Speaker 2
Because often I hear folks say, oh, I'm just the BTR and I'm like one of the starting points of revenue generating kind of functions. And oh, that's a big deal. A large portion of.

00:28:38:00 - 00:28:39:02
Speaker 1
The face of the company.

00:28:39:02 - 00:29:01:01
Speaker 2
You're the first conversation that they get. You are super important. So, so we're like leaders of that and it's okay to go to a meeting and say like, Hey, I need some support. But it's also important that you establish itself as a professional because if you're not showing up prepared, if you're not showing up as a person who's equal partner, they're going to treat you that it.

00:29:01:06 - 00:29:19:16
Speaker 2
So there's two sides of it and I definitely have experienced both sides, but in the best relationships that I've seen and when I'm coaching to now is going to be of equal partnership collaborative. How can I help you? How can we help each other? But also how can we do this successfully and efficiently so we can repeat this and continue to build it?

00:29:19:17 - 00:29:47:11
Speaker 1
I always find it wild when an Annie takes that perspective of lesser them. When they look at a BTR and SDR, and I'm like, You know, you have to remind them sometimes, Hey, that was you like two years ago. Like, don't forget where you came from, right? But that's yeah. And I think if you can get someone that's self-aware, then that will usually make them click back to realize like, all right, this is a, this is a person I need to work with, not someone who works for me.

00:29:47:11 - 00:29:47:21
Speaker 1
Right?

00:29:47:21 - 00:30:13:02
Speaker 2
Correct. Correct. And this is support. It's a support system because if you're if you're doing the pipeline generation yourself in the shell side of it, anybody that's supporting you in that it's extra support, right? You're also have an opportunity to coach and to be a peer mentor because you're working alongside this person. So if you have best practices that have helped to evolve into the sales rep that you are a you're passionate on to them, that only accelerates their growth, right?

00:30:13:02 - 00:30:36:04
Speaker 2
And that only gives them an opportunity to have a viewpoint and also a mentor to ask these questions to help make their job a little bit better and make them more efficient in return. It's still helping you do that. So I think that we have to look at it as a collaborative partnership that we have, even though at the end of the day and if you do that and you have that mutual respect and both sides will work harder for the other person, that's what I believe.

00:30:36:23 - 00:31:05:03
Speaker 1
Teamwork makes the dream work 100%. Absolutely. Absolutely. So you change the topic here. We work with a lot of NCAA student athletes. Right. And, you know, the reality is, is that 50% of athletes are females. Right. And unfortunately, I think software specifically has done a really bad job where there's a lot of people that look like me right on sales floors across the country.

00:31:06:02 - 00:31:21:05
Speaker 1
But for the women that are listening to this episode that are considering a career in sales, is there any like different specific guidance that you would share with our female candidates and those females out there looking to break into the industry?

00:31:21:05 - 00:31:51:11
Speaker 2
Porsche Yeah, a couple of things. I think networking is key. There are organizations and leaders and folks that really give a good perspective and also leadership and mentorship on this exact situation. I'm a part of an organization called Girls Club right now where I'm in the last month of my manager leadership program and I, they have been so influential in even my today my role I have today in different aspects of the business that I wouldn't have learned or had supporting otherwise.

00:31:51:11 - 00:32:17:09
Speaker 2
Right. So put yourself in situations where you're working with people that look like you or care, to put people like you in any position and learn from them. Like ask for help. There's mentorships out there that give you partnerships with people who have been through all the things. It could potentially be a voice for you to help navigate the space a little bit better because again, it's very siloed if you don't have that opportunity to have someone to lean on.

00:32:17:09 - 00:32:33:01
Speaker 2
Right, because most of our our friends and they don't work in tech, you know, they don't know anything about our world. They just know the brand names of our companies. And that's so cool. But in terms of the little nuances that happen throughout have no clue. So networking is going to be the first name sake you think, ladies, should you shop?

00:32:33:14 - 00:32:56:13
Speaker 2
The best thing somebody can tell you is no, because what no brings is actual opportunity to learn and grow of what you need to do and to it actually gives you an answer on whether, hey, you may not think that I'm prepared, but this may have not been the opportunity for me because I think there's so much power and know that we give this tip typically negative, that we should just flip that around, take the shot, learn from the opportunity.

00:32:56:13 - 00:33:16:22
Speaker 2
Either you get the job or you don't ask for feedback because that's what's going to get you ready for the next job that may be for you. I always say like, what is our our worse than actual training? Because what is going to linger in your mind forever? Trying gives you an actual action in an actual complete thought about what it could potentially be.

00:33:17:03 - 00:33:38:19
Speaker 2
And when I look at my career, that's what it was. It's like, Do you want to think about what it could have been versus go try it to actually have a solution or a conclusion? So as you continue to navigate this space lady listeners really apply, really apply yourself with people that you feel can give you that insight and people that may not like I.

00:33:38:21 - 00:33:59:14
Speaker 2
One thing I love about Girls Club is that we have male mentors. We have people who have are in the space and we talk about these things about women don't show up to these roles or apply because they don't feel prepared. It's okay, go apply for those jobs because 100% men will. 70% of us white and we have all the boxes.

00:34:00:04 - 00:34:06:11
Speaker 2
So shoot your shot, be confident, get an answer, ask for feedback and get you a mentor because it'll change your life.

00:34:07:09 - 00:34:29:12
Speaker 1
I love that. And the data supports what you just said, right? Like if two if a male and a female look at a job posting and they both have the same experience, the male is more likely to to apply for that role. Even if they aren't, they are suited for it than the female. Right. And the other the other thing that we coach our our female candidates on our is negotiate.

00:34:29:12 - 00:34:38:19
Speaker 1
Right. Some of them don't want to negotiate. You've got to realize your leverage, your value and don't be afraid to push back when you get that offer right.

00:34:39:18 - 00:35:06:10
Speaker 2
80% of our job is pushing back as a. Yeah, so if you can't do that for you, you can do it on behalf of a company, but you can't do that on behalf of yourself. Something's wrong with that. So what I say is that that ownership and know your value and know your worth. Like if I'm going to fight for you every single day in the trenches getting told no cost the I'm going to fight for myself up front to make sure I'm being fairly compensated or what my needs are addressed.

00:35:06:10 - 00:35:14:00
Speaker 2
And if you can't give me that it's okay to walk away is scary. Times not going to say it's not, but it's okay to walk away.

00:35:14:14 - 00:35:23:18
Speaker 1
It is. It is definitely. By the way, if you ever write a book, I got the title for you. It's going to be called The Power of Now. I love that. That's your new book.

00:35:24:12 - 00:35:28:13
Speaker 2
Thank you. Thank you. I've been thinking about that. But, you know, we'll we'll talk later about that.

00:35:32:06 - 00:35:40:07
Speaker 1
Mentorship so important, right. Are there any mentors that you've had that have have had an impact on your sales career? And what are the things you learned from them?

00:35:40:07 - 00:36:00:06
Speaker 2
Yeah, honestly, I have about four and I sounds like a lot, but they all are different parts of my life, right? I have my coach back when I decided to join volleyball, she was so tough. I was just like, I don't talk to this lady. Like she is like not the white one, but she challenged me. That was the reason why I was like so challenged by her.

00:36:00:06 - 00:36:17:11
Speaker 2
And even to this day, like, I can call her in and say something. And she challenged me to actually give her answers and to really think about the things that I was saying and doing and it really made me more self aware, like, Hey, how are you doing? I'm okay. I would say that all the time. She's like, Why are you just okay?

00:36:18:01 - 00:36:36:01
Speaker 2
And reality was, I wasn't just okay. I had great things happening, but I was minimizing those things. So like those little nuances are still with me to this day. Are those little, little things that I like when my reps say it, I'm like, So what does that mean for you? And they're like, Oh, well. And I'm like, Savannah them right now because I used to get that happened to me.

00:36:37:08 - 00:37:00:05
Speaker 2
Girls Club provided me with an amazing who most recently helped me with negotiating my most recent salary renegotiation for a role that I had. And she was so influential in me understanding the best way to have that conversation down to the parallels of creating a spreadsheet, discuss my my.

00:37:00:05 - 00:37:00:16
Speaker 1
Role.

00:37:00:20 - 00:37:28:06
Speaker 2
What I was expected to do, what I was doing, how it compares, and just really talking through those. What could be the tough questions I can ask it how to be able to have that conversation because I never had to renegotiate a contract or a salary like this is new for me, right? So give. So you're just someone who understands that world and understands that C-level executive level conversations, because if you're going to be a frontline manager, you're going to be told what to do often enough and not understand those insights.

00:37:28:06 - 00:37:44:06
Speaker 2
Then sometimes people feel jaded by that, but when you have a perspective of what they're doing, it gives you a different kind of viewpoint of how to manage it and not be so a conflicted about what's happening and understanding like their level and what they're thinking for the long term. But she helped me see that side of it.

00:37:44:14 - 00:38:03:02
Speaker 2
And so often enough I talk to my director and she's just like, You really get it? You understand? I'm like, Yeah, but I also have a coach who's helped me get to this point because I probably felt the same a different way a year ago. And lastly, through my women's organization that I found when I was early on networking, there's someone who doesn't even work in the tech space anymore.

00:38:03:09 - 00:38:26:20
Speaker 2
She is on businesses outside of this world and is super involved with other ventures and just seem like her being able to come from Cisco and work for the IBM and work for these other companies and to continue to climb the ladder. Her ownership of her own destiny is just like so empowering and it gives me a perspective of like most people feel trapped in their work, right?

00:38:26:20 - 00:38:46:06
Speaker 2
Like they just do it because that's what they're supposed to do. But her manager is like, I do what I want to do because this is what I'm passionate about and these are the things that it helps me get it, whether that's the financial network or opportunities. But there is more to just work than just work. And I, and I, I think she's super inspiring.

00:38:46:09 - 00:38:59:09
Speaker 2
Are all of these mentors, by the way, have been through networks. I didn't just find these people out of the blue like I was a part of a group and they're all people willing to raise their hand to say, I'm willing to talk to you and spend time with you to help you develop your career.

00:39:00:12 - 00:39:08:02
Speaker 1
What would you recommend to be like? Your you're a mentor to these people. What's a good mentee like? What's what are good habits and practices for good mentees?

00:39:08:11 - 00:39:30:15
Speaker 2
Yeah, consistency, I think is important. If you're going to if you're going to coach someone, you need to be present. And we have all have busy lives, but this is something that you signed up for is that commitment to this person needs to be just as important as anything else on your schedule because they're trying to figure it out and you're also being an example of who they are, who they should be.

00:39:30:15 - 00:39:59:05
Speaker 2
Right. So making sure you're showing up for them the best place possible. Listening, active, listening. I think that's super important. Really hear them out and what's really happening for them and being able not necessarily always to find a solution, but sometimes just listen and ask them, do they want your opinion? Because yes, you're a mentee, but you don't have to resolve everybody's problems, you know, maybe giving them the the curiosity of like, hey, I read this book and this gave me some perspective, like, maybe you should read that.

00:39:59:06 - 00:40:11:02
Speaker 2
Let's talk about what you learned from it rather than giving them the answers. Because if you can teach people how to hunt, some of these things won't even be an issue anymore. They can figure out for themselves how to cope in the space. And I think that that's super important.

00:40:13:00 - 00:40:30:05
Speaker 1
For all the males listening that are in relationships. That was a huge thing you just said because you don't always have to have an answer. Sometimes you just trust me. I'm almost always 47. So now I realize like, I don't always need to answer that question. Sometimes you just need to be there to listen, right?

00:40:30:12 - 00:40:39:06
Speaker 2
My favorite one is like, I just like, how can I help? How can I help? It's like, I don't want you to have as one. Oh, this is great. I know. I'm going to continue to.

00:40:41:04 - 00:40:59:17
Speaker 1
You you when you mention your your volleyball coach, I immediately my father coach high school hockey for 30 years. And I when I was younger I hated it because he was a he's a he's a tough like he's a tough cookie. Right. So when when I would run into his old players in their early twenties, they were like, your dad's and your dad's an asshole, right?

00:40:59:18 - 00:41:17:06
Speaker 1
And then you find out, you see those two kids now that were almost 40. A lot of them have their own kids that are growing up playing sports. Everybody has something positive to say about my dad because now they're looking back at how he was to them being tough on them, and now it's that in a positive light.

00:41:17:06 - 00:41:21:03
Speaker 1
It's crazy how that changes over time as you mature as a person, right?

00:41:21:11 - 00:41:38:21
Speaker 2
Yeah. You start to realize that it wasn't them necessarily challenging you about what? You were just challenged by the situation at the time, right? Was it actually the right thing to do? Was the right thing to say, are you doing it? You're very, very bad. And most of the time most of us will say, No, I wasn't. But it just didn't feel good to be told that in the moment.

00:41:38:21 - 00:41:57:05
Speaker 2
And I thought I knew everything. But now as an adult, you kind of have this different frame of mind and time that does give you perspective to say, like myself as coach, Oh, oh, it was hard. It was hard. It was tough. The sport. But discipline, dedication and determination are things that he taught me. He taught me early is on time.

00:41:57:05 - 00:42:09:08
Speaker 2
On time of late and late is never acceptable. But these little things were planted seeds over the years from this guy that I was just like, This is like ridiculous. And then when I say them out loud, I'm like.

00:42:09:08 - 00:42:09:09
Speaker 1
I.

00:42:10:00 - 00:42:23:11
Speaker 2
Have been as a road. That's what I call that. He is one of my basketball coaches, but it's so true. And those are things that actually matter, not just in sports but in life. And those are the coaches that I think matter because they give you things that you can use not just on the court, but throughout your life.

00:42:24:20 - 00:42:38:18
Speaker 1
So it's so true. So last couple questions for sure. We always ask our guests what's what's what's a skill that you develop in sales that really makes you elite, what's what's yours?

00:42:39:10 - 00:43:04:11
Speaker 2
I would say this is part sales, part teaching, because I had a sales job before I was a teacher. And I often say like, I'm a good teacher because I went to sales first. And then when I came back to sales, I was like, I'm a great sales leader now because I was a teacher first. And I think that IQ, I think IQ is is the thing that I have that gives me edge and leverage in ability to coach people no matter where they're at.

00:43:04:19 - 00:43:25:05
Speaker 2
And it's because I can read them very well. I have the I've been in their shoes, you know, I've been in other areas of life. And it gives me that perspective to be able to look at it, not from the short sighted or one sided perspective, gives me a whole viewpoint of who they are as a person. And I, I use that IQ to coach the person where they're at.

00:43:25:05 - 00:43:28:23
Speaker 2
And I think that that's something that's super important and doesn't always happen, especially in sales.

00:43:29:20 - 00:43:53:06
Speaker 1
Yeah. IQ, I mean, that's, that's first of all, an awesome trait to have and that's why you're a leader, right? That's the most important characteristic to have as a leader, I think. All right. So we growing up, my dad used to tell us, right, like there's a lot of people that play hockey, but there's not a lot of hockey players, meaning, like, are you like living in are you are you a professional?

00:43:53:06 - 00:44:05:06
Speaker 1
Like, is this what you're going to do? And we think the guy is phrase you can give a salesperson is calling them a pro. What is that? What does that mean to you? What does it mean being a pro in sales? What does that mean to you?

00:44:06:00 - 00:44:28:18
Speaker 2
Yeah, you're not just showing up for the job. You have the business acumen, you have the investment, you have the curiosity that is going to take you. So beyond sales because of it that it just makes you better in sales, right? We want we were aiming for a better life at the end of the day, like this is and this is an opportunity to have a career that's going to additionally support your life.

00:44:29:01 - 00:44:35:01
Speaker 2
And if you show up with that business acumen, that attention to detail, curiosity, like that's what makes your pro.

00:44:35:22 - 00:44:46:14
Speaker 1
100%. Sky's the limit when you bring that to the table. Right? I love it. Porsche, this is going to be required listening to our candidates. This was an unbelievable. Thank you.

00:44:46:14 - 00:45:12:02
Speaker 2
So awesome. Yeah, this was fantastic. I really do appreciate it. And to give you guys a little bit of backstory, if you have I have the moment is like I reached out to you and just said how you really stood out to me on a on a podcast that I listen to. And I just as a former athlete, it was awesome and refreshing to hear a perspective of someone who came from that world but also has changed their lives with sales.

00:45:12:10 - 00:45:30:00
Speaker 2
And this was just literally like a prospect thing, and it was more or less of just saying, Thank you for sharing that. I just want to connect with you and follow you. And you're just like, you're awesome. So for folks out there, like I mentioned, shoot your shot, like this was just mutual connection of me. Just generate admiration that turned into actually having my first podcast experience.

00:45:30:00 - 00:45:31:15
Speaker 2
I really do appreciate that opportunity.

00:45:32:03 - 00:45:36:12
Speaker 1
I don't think this will be your last for sure. You're going to be getting hit up. You're a great guest.

00:45:36:15 - 00:45:40:00
Speaker 2
Well, thank you so much. Yeah, it was awesome being here and appreciate the time.

00:45:40:17 - 00:45:46:15
Speaker 1
And I'm grateful I get to follow. You can't wait. If you need a quote for the back of Tower of No, let me know. I'll be the.

00:45:46:15 - 00:45:54:00
Speaker 2
Comedian. I need it starting now. You got it formulating my brain. So now I got to dig into this.

00:45:54:00 - 00:45:55:13
Speaker 1
Thank you. Push. Have a great day.

00:45:55:23 - 00:45:59:22
Speaker 2
Hey, guys, you.

00:45:59:22 - 00:46:22:15
Speaker 1
This wraps up this episode of Making Some Change. If you enjoyed this episode, the most meaningful way to say thanks is to submit a review wherever you listen to podcasts. If you're interested in working with us, please come find us at WW Dot Chef Group Dot I.